A Leauki's Writings

I am often told that there is anti-Semitism. In fact I have seen it. Almost everyone tells me that anti-Semitism is a bad thing and must be fought. In fact that point is often brought up by the same people who tell me something else as well.

They tell me that the "Palestinian Cause" is a noble cause and not related to anti-Semitism in any way; that the leaders of the Palestinian Cause and the Palestinian people have to be supported and that their fight is necessary and noble. And anyway, Israel has no reason to fight them and is the cause for the war. "We are all Hamas."

So I took the liberty of selecting a few quotes by respected leaders of the Palestinian Cause, by people celebrated by Palestinians and other Arabs today. I am here showing these quotes mixed with a few quotes by Nazis so as to present the stark difference between the evil ideology of anti-Semitism and the noble Palestinian Cause.

Of course those same people have also said other things. But Hitler also spoke about art and managed to get a few words out without sounding like a racist. So I carefully selected only those quotes that were representative of what I think could easily be mistaken for anti-Semitism.

One might argue that Zionists also make anti-Arab statements that make Zionism appear racist. But the question is whether most Jews or Israelis (or any supporters of Zionism) really consider those Zionists representative of the Zionist movement or the Jewish nation. The Arabs among the quotes were and remain respected leaders of the Palestinian Cause and are among the people I am told are our "partners" in the peace talks.

If you find a racist quote by a Zionist, I'll tell you what I think of that Zionist and I guarantee you that such a person would not have the support of a majority of Israelis or Jews.

 

And here we go: the quotes. Can you even tell who is a Nazi and who is a supporter of the noble Palestinian cause or what that cause is? Remember that we are told that the "Palestinian cause" is not about killing Jews or the destruction of Israel. And remember that the Arabs quoted are considered heroes of the Palestinian cause by Hamas and the PLO. They ARE representative of the Palestinian cause. THEY are the people you demonstrate for when you condemn Israel for fighting them.

"We shall not enter Palestine with its soil covered in sand, we shall enter it with its soil saturated in blood"

"The existence of Israel has continued too long. We welcome the Israeli aggression. We welcome the battle we have long awaited. The peak hour has come. The battle has come in which we shall destroy Israel."

“All Egypt is now prepared to plunge into total war which will put an end to Israel”

“The Zionist barrack in Palestine is about to collapse and be destroyed. Every one of the hundred million Arabs has been living for the past nineteen years on one hope – to live to see the day Israel is liquidated…There is no life, no peace nor hope for the gangs of Zionism to remain in the occupied land.”

“As of today, there no longer exists an international emergency force to protect Israel….The sole method we shall apply against Israel is a total war which will result in the extermination of Zionist existence”.

“Our forces are now entirely ready not only to repulse any aggression, but to initiate the act ourselves, and to explode the Zionist presence in the Arab homeland of Palestine. The Syrian army, with its finger on the trigger, is united. I believe that the time has come to begin a battle of anihilation.”

"We want a full scale, popular war of liberation… to destroy the Zionist enemy"

“We will not accept any…coexistence with Israel.…Today the issue is not the establishment of peace between the Arab states and Israel….The war with Israel is in effect since 1948.”

“The existence of Israel is an error which must be rectified. This is our opportunity to wipe out the ignominy which has been with us since 1948. Our goal is clear - to wipe Israel off the map”

“Those [Israelis] who survive will remain in Palestine. I estimate that none of them will survive.”

"Germany and Italy recognize the right of the Arab countries to solve the question of the Jewish elements, which exist in Palestine and in the other Arab countries, as required by the national and ethnic interests of the Arabs, and as the Jewish question was solved in Germany and Italy."

"To the Grand Mufti: The National Socialist movement of Greater Germany has, since its inception, inscribed upon its flag the fight against the world Jewry. It has therefore followed with particular sympathy the struggle of freedom-loving Arabs, especially in Palestine, against Jewish interlopers. In the recognition of this enemy and of the common struggle against it lies the firm foundation of the natural alliance that exists between the National Socialist Greater Germany and the freedom-loving Muslims of the whole world. In this spirit I am sending you on the anniversary of the infamous Balfour declaration my hearty greetings and wishes for the successful pursuit of your struggle until the final victory."

"Israel will exist and will continue to exist until Islam will obliterate it, just as it obliterated others before it."

"After Palestine, the Zionists aspire to expand from the Nile to the Euphrates. When they will have digested the region they overtook, they will aspire to further expansion, and so on. Their plan is embodied in the "Protocols of the Elders of Zion", and their present conduct is the best proof of what we are saying."

"There is no solution for the Palestinian question except through Jihad. Initiatives, proposals and international conferences are all a waste of time and vain endeavors."



Comments (Page 5)
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on Oct 19, 2009

One final comment, forget the fact that you are Jewish, and forget the fact that the Palestinians are Arabs, and Iam of Scottish, Irish, Jewish decent, and get back to basics, ethnicly we are different, yet we are all the genetically, Human Beings. Then lets look at the teachings of Jesus, and then we can start to change the entire problem, because it is only then we can see we are all equal.

The other point is we all follow the same God, Jew, Christian and Muslim, yet we spend most of our time fighting, in the end it all seems quite pointless when you look at, men fighting men, with no concern for their families or those of their percieved enemy.  These are the inocent victims of war.

All the rest is just fluf to make our leaders look like big men, the day a Prime Minister, President or defense minister lead the troops into battle, is the day we all stop fighting, why? Because its easier to send someone else, than do it yourself. Think about that.

Fighting over land is just a stupid as any other excuse, and I find that most leaders who lead in war are incapable of finding peace, why, because all they know is how to fight a war, just look at the leadership of Fatah and Hamas, these guys are soldiers, so they want to keep fighting, because that is all they know. While this situation exists, there will be no peace, all the excuses are just that, they just don't know how to have peace, the same goes for your government, you have no new leadership, just the same ones recycled again and again.

The problem with peace in you neck f the woods is the fact that they try to fix the problem as it stands now, this won't work. Both sides need to wipe the slate clean and design new solutions that will work, instead of trying to fix the existing rpoblems. This is one of the first rules of problem solving at any level. Which I might add is my rpofession, solving problems for businesses. Countries are the same, with one glaring problem, politicans ( most of whom would not no their arse from their armpit), they are generally not any more qualified than you or I, and quite possible less, yet we expect them to be almost Gods, and they start to think so too.

Anywho, that's it for me, it's back to hospital for me, for another few months, hopefully when I get back I can control myself better, if I have offended anyone, please forgive me. Hopefully this stay will be shorter and get better results. It has been a long self imposed break from JU for me but judgeing by my comments in the last few days still not well enough to be a fully contributing member. It's not so much about controlling myself, just the other selves, who still take over at times, yes more than one personality, 3 to be exact. It's no big deal, just managing them sometimes can be a handfull, sometimes quite funny if we are all there together, how I got them is another story, which I don't share with anyone.

So once again guys thanks for the great read, and sorry for any hurt I may have caused anyone.

Will Miss you all, even you Leauki and with a bit of luck will be back soon, and in control.

on Oct 19, 2009

First came the Hebrews....meant originally a stranger, a foreigner. According to Genesis 14:13, the first person designated as a Hebrew was Abraham (forefather of the Isrealites, and Abraham was not a Jew) becasue he was a foreigner in Canaan, who had come from the other side of the Euphrates River. Isaias 19:18 tells us the name "Hebrew" was later given to the "language of Canaan" and was applied to the "Jews" who spoke the holy language in contrast to the Hellenic "Jews" who spoke the Greek language only.

This is weird.

I already explained what "Hebrew" meant and yet you feel a strange need to replace my explanation with something wrong.

It is always a bit of a shock to me when you tell people what Hebrew words mean because I cannot figure out what your sources are.

The word Hebrew from the root Ayin Bet Resh doesn't mean "stranger" or "foreigner" but "cross over" as I just wrote a few comments earlier. Here is a dictionary reference for you:

http://www.milon.co.il/general/general.php?term=%D7%A2%D7%91%D7%A8

You can also confirm this for Aramaic:

http://cal1.cn.huc.edu/searching/fulldictionary_search.html

The root you are looking for is "(br".

And of course Abraham was not a Jew. As I explained (also in my previous comments), "Jews" are members of the three tribes of Judaea. All Jews are Israelites but not all Israelites are Jews. (For example, the Samaritans are Israelites but not Jews.)

 

Yes, this is true for the terms "Hebrews", "Isrealites" and "Jews" cannot rightly be used interchangeably.

Most people do call a Hebrew a Jew, and also an Isrealite a Jew. But calling them such does not give him a distinctive character and neither does it inform us whether he is a believer in Mosaic principles and practices as the term Hebrew did four plus centuries before Christ and the Christian era.

That is religious nonsense. The definition of "Israelite" or "Jew" has nothing to do with Christianity.

It is perfectly appropriate to use the term "Jew" as a placeholder for "Israelite" since 95+% of Israelites are Jews. There are 1600 or so Samraitans, about 200,000 (perhaps) Ethiopian "Jews" (aka the tribe of Dan) and a few thousand members of other tribes. But the 10-15 million "Jews" you read about in encyclopedia are really the most representative tribe of the people.

Israel still celebrates the twelve tribes at every Independence Day so you don't have to be worried about them being forgotten. We remember them every year.

An Israelite does not have to believe in Mosaic principles to be an Israelite. (And neither does a German have to pray to Thor or whatever it is those people were doing 2000 years ago.)

 

 

on Oct 19, 2009

One final comment, forget the fact that you are Jewish, and forget the fact that the Palestinians are Arabs, and Iam of Scottish, Irish, Jewish decent, and get back to basics, ethnicly we are different, yet we are all the genetically, Human Beings. Then lets look at the teachings of Jesus, and then we can start to change the entire problem, because it is only then we can see we are all equal.

You still misunderstand the point.

This is not about Arabs being "different". It is about them attacking us and trying to kill us. If they didn't do that, there would be no justification to "oppress" them or to fight them. And Israel never wanted to fight an enemy 12 times the size of the Israeli army.

As I have mentioned before I have nothing but the greatest respect for any Bedouin who fights for Israel and I don't care whether someone who helps protect Israel is a Jew or an Arab or a Darfuri refugee or whatever.

The issue I have is with, to go back to the original article, "We shall not enter Palestine with its soil covered in sand, we shall enter it with its soil saturated in blood" announcement the Arabs made before 1967 and other intentions like that. The issue is NOT their nationality it's their ideology.

I am German, myself (as well as Jewish).

And my issue with Germany in World War 2 was NOT the fact that it was Germany (love the country) but its Nazi ideology.

And in the same vein my issue with the PLO and Hamas and Hizbullah and all those terrorists is not their Arab nationality but their Nazi ideology.

"Palestinian" television regularly shows those Hamas plays where they call for the extermination of all Jews. They don't do this because they are Arabs. They do it because they are fecking Nazis.

Israeli television never calls for the extermination of all Arabs. And while I want to believe that the reason it doesn't do that is because Jews don't advocate murder, it's really only true that Zionists don't advocate murder.

That's why an Arab can walk through a Jewish city in Israel and survive. (Heck, I myself shared a university dorm in Haifa with Arab students.)

Try the same trick as a Jew in an Arab city anywhere in the Arab world and you'll perceive a difference.

And if you don't think that difference justifies war then I suggest you practice what you believe and get yourself killed, not me.

 

and forget the fact that the Palestinians are Arabs

Palestinians are not "Arabs". They are Jews and Arabs and Circassians and Armenians and Turks and countless other nationalities living side by side in Israel/Palestine.

Try finding a single reference to "Palestinian" as specifically Arab before the 1960s. (There are references to "Palestinian" referring to specifically Jews.)

Claiming that "Palestinians" are "Arabs" not only insults Jews because it uses a word made up by the Romans to insult Judaism as if it was a real name for a people or a region but it also denies the fact that there were indeed always non-Arab people who lived in the country. Denying their existence isn't helpful. (And it is ironic considering how many anti-Semites will tell you that Zionists deny that Arabs ever lived in "Palestine". I have never met a Zionist who denied that Arabs lived in "Palestine". But I know plenty of anti-Zionists who insist that "Palestinians" are "Arabs".)

Saying that "Palestinians are Arabs" is as wrong as claiming that "Americans are English". While it is true that many Americans are English or of English descent, Americans (named after the location) are also Irish and German and French and some few native Americans. In the same way "Palestine" contains people ("Palestinians") who are of mostly Arab descent but also of native (Israelite/Jewish) descent and of Armenian descent etc..

Plus the Arab-only simplification of the issue ignores the Druz and Bedouin who have different cultures still and do not necessarily want to be seen as a monolithic unit with other Arabs.

 

 

on Oct 19, 2009

Fighting over land is just a stupid as any other excuse, and I find that most leaders who lead in war are incapable of finding peace, why, because all they know is how to fight a war, just look at the leadership of Fatah and Hamas, these guys are soldiers, so they want to keep fighting, because that is all they know. While this situation exists, there will be no peace, all the excuses are just that, they just don't know how to have peace, the same goes for your government, you have no new leadership, just the same ones recycled again and again.

It's the smalles conflict in the Middle-East causing the fewest deaths.

In Israel fewer people die of all those wars and terror attacks than in traffic accidents.

And while the world spends hours every day to look at Jerusalem, wondering why the Jews consider themselves the "chosen people", the holocaust in Darfur continues and nobody cares.

Fatah and Hamas are not "soldiers", they are terrorists. Soldiers do not attack kindergardens and cinemas. Soldiers do not blow up shopping malls and hospitals. Fatah and Hamas ALWAYS target schools and hospitals and absolutely everything that contains many Jewish children. It is a miracle that so few Jews die in this conflict, but much of it really had to do with the evacuation plans (the population of Israel is often moved around the country depending on where the war is).

Israel has changed leadership many, many times. But Fatah and Hamas are always ruled by the same people.

Either way, this war has killed fewer people than most peaces have in the region.

And the "oppression" of the "Palestinians" has resulted in them having a higher standard of living then Egyptians and Syrians.

But for some reason the world seems to be unable to distinguish between "Arab" and "terrorist" and hence cannot get it into its collective mind that Israel might want to shoot at terrorists but not necessarily at Arabs.

Trust me, if a non-Arab army decided to invade Israel, Israel would shoot at those attackers too.

 

on Oct 19, 2009

All the rest is just fluf to make our leaders look like big men, the day a Prime Minister, President or defense minister lead the troops into battle, is the day we all stop fighting, why? Because its easier to send someone else, than do it yourself. Think about that.

All Jewish and Druze and most Bedouin Israelis have been in the army.

I myself have been in two wars, in my position as civilian. I have seen rockets fly and hit things.

Most Israeli politicians have been in the army, most have been war heroes. Ariel Sharon was a tank commander. His second-in-command Majalli Wahabi was an infantry deputy brigade commander. Bibi Netanyahu was reconnaissanc. His brother died in abttle in Uganda. Ehud Barak was Head of Staff in the Israeli army.

I am thinking about it. What's the point? I cannot think of the relevance here.

The vast majority of leading Israeli politicians are highly-decorated war heroes, both Jewish and Arab. They never send anyone into a war they have not fought themselves too.

 

 

 

on Oct 19, 2009

leauki posts:

You are confused Lula, you keep forgetting that I am speaking of "peoples", not "races".

I'm not confused...I've tried to be very terminologcially clear...

As far as "race" goes you said in post # 43...

43

Just 60 years ago Jews were a "race", now, apparently, they don't have the right to be a "people" any more. Judaism is the religion of the Jewish people. But the Jewish (Israelite) people have existed before the religion was introduced.

Leauki posts 43

The Jewish people who now inhabit Israel are Israelites,

Again, let's try for terminological exactitude....The people who inhabit the state of Isreal are Isrealis, not Isrealites. Isrealites  from Exodus 3:15,  stems from Jacob, the son of Isaac, whose name God changed to Isreal. The name Isreal was later given at a later date to the 10 northern tribes that have disappeared. 1Kings 2:28-30.

Trust me, if a non-Arab army decided to invade Israel, Israel would shoot at those attackers too.

Duh! That's a no -brainer.

Now, back to the topic...it IS THE JEWISH ARMY THAT INVADED, THEN OCCUPIED ARAB HELD LANDS THAT NOW MAKE UP THE STATE OF ISREAL.

 

on Oct 19, 2009

leauki posts:


The original Israelites were a Canaanite people (not Arab) led by Abraham (who was himself from northern Mesopotamia). They spoke Hebrew, a Canaanite language......both the Bible .....tell that story as does every history book. )

... Abraham was from Aram Naharaim..... The Israelites, the people he founded in Canaan is an emphatic state of the word, Hebrew "lehakni3a" based on the same root means "to subdue" or "to make low") spoke a Canaanite language (Hebrew,.....

From Abraham descended Yishmael, who was, according to Qur'an, the ancestor of Muhammad.....

lula 52

First came the Hebrews....meant originally a stranger, a foreigner. According to Genesis 14:13, the first person designated as a Hebrew was Abraham (forefather of the Isrealites, and Abraham was not a Jew) becasue he was a foreigner in Canaan, who had come from the other side of the Euphrates River. Isaias 19:18 tells us the name "Hebrew" was later given to the "language of Canaan" and was applied to the "Jews" who spoke the holy language in contrast to the Hellenic "Jews" who spoke the Greek language only.

leauki posts:

I already explained what "Hebrew" meant and yet you feel a strange need to replace my explanation with something wrong.

Everything I said is correct. I just added additional information to yours. Re; the highlighted....Actaully, Abraham didn't "found the Isrealites", he founded the Hebrews and it was Jacob the son of Isaac who founded the Isrealites.

 

It is always a bit of a shock to me when you tell people what Hebrew words mean because I cannot figure out what your sources are.

My source was Sacred Scripture...read those passages and you'll find they support what I said.

The word Hebrew from the root Ayin Bet Resh doesn't mean "stranger" or "foreigner" but "cross over" as I just wrote a few comments earlier. Here is a dictionary reference for you:

.

I'm not going to nit-pick over this. I recognize that considerable differences of opinion exist as to the origin of the term "Hebrew". It's generally held to be a primitive word connected with Hebner....the region beyond the Euphraptes. The Septuagint renders it Perates..a stranger from a foreign land...and that is exactly who Abraham was...And again, Abraham is the first Hebrew recorded in the Old Testament.

In Gen. 40:15, Joseph said, "I was stolen away out of the land of the Hebrews." meaning his people in the land of Canaan.

All Jews were not Hebrews , yet all Hebrews were Jews at the time and for 3 centuries before the Coming of Christ.

 

That is religious nonsense. The definition of "Israelite" or "Jew" has nothing to do with Christianity.

Leauki,

Ya, we know...whatever you disagree with is labeled "nonsense".

But Leauki...it's time to GET REAL. Those defintions are what they are....the Messias came..."Emmanuel with us". Everything changed with the Christ's Life, Death and Resurrection.

 

 

on Oct 19, 2009

And Israel never wanted to fight an enemy 12 times the size of the Israeli army.

Again...time to GET REAL.

The Palestinian people may be more in number but they are fighting with sticks and stones compared to Isreal's power and military might.

Isreal has got to stop playing the victim.

 

 

on Oct 20, 2009



Again, let's try for terminological exactitude....The people who inhabit the state of Isreal are Isrealis, not Isrealites.



Israelis include Arabs. Israelites are Jews and Samaritans.




Now, back to the topic...it IS THE JEWISH ARMY THAT INVADED, THEN OCCUPIED ARAB HELD LANDS THAT NOW MAKE UP THE STATE OF ISREAL.



The land was BOUGHT, not invaded.

I realise that for you Jews buying land is probably the same as invasion, but that doesn't mean that it's morally the same for everybody else.

The land was also not Arab, it was Turkish when the Jews started buying it and British when Israel got its independence.

I think you are thinking of whatever Arab state Israel was a part of hundreds of years ago before the Turks invaded it.

You are a liar, Lula, and it's not that you are just re-telling lies others told you. You specifically and actively tell lies even when told the truth




The Palestinian people may be more in number but they are fighting with sticks and stones compared to Isreal's power and military might.



Lula, I know that you are well aware of the fact that Israel's wars were against several Arab countries, NOT the "Palestinians".

You cannot have it both ways. Either you claim that Israel has been at constant war with all of its neighbours XOR you claim that Israel has been fighting only the "Palestinians". Only one of them can be true.

You are trying to blame the Jews for being at war with everyone and for being at war with a small impotent people.




I'm not going to nit-pick over this. I recognize that considerable differences of opinion exist as to the origin of the term "Hebrew".



In a way. There are those who simply read the Hebrew word and know what it means. And there are those who simply make up something they want it to mean.

That's a "difference of opinion", if you want. It's the same difference of opinion we might have about another random Semitic word that I happen to know and you don't.




It's generally held to be a primitive word connected with Hebner....the region beyond the Euphraptes. The Septuagint renders it Perates..a stranger from a foreign land...and that is exactly who Abraham was...And again, Abraham is the first Hebrew recorded in the Old Testament.

In Gen. 40:15, Joseph said, "I was stolen away out of the land of the Hebrews." meaning his people in the land of Canaan.

All Jews were not Hebrews , yet all Hebrews were Jews at the time and for 3 centuries before the Coming of Christ.



You got it confused again.

All Jews are Hebrews but not all Hebrews are Jews. Neither now nor 2000 years ago.




Ya, we know...whatever you disagree with is labeled "nonsense".



Nope. I just happen to disagree with a lot of nonsense.

There are lot of things I disagree with that are not nonsense, like social welfare, specific public health insurance systems, the Christian religion (except your weird fanatical branch), Islam, Hinduism, stamp-collecting. You name it...

But sometimes, dear Lula, lies are being told, often by you. And I disagree with those because they are nonsense.

You have a problem in that you are trying to tell lies about the Talmud (in past discussions) to someone who has actually read the passages you think you were quoting. And you have a problem in that you are trying to tell lies about the origins of the modern state of Israel to someone who has actually seen original news paper articles from the time and spoken to the children of the very Arabs you claim the Jews wanted to drive out.

You *think* that the Zionists wanted (and want) to expel the Arabs and steal their land. And you tell people this thing as if it were a fact.

I *am* a Zionist and I *know* that I don't want to expel Arabs and that I have the greatest respect for the Druze and Bedouin who helped defend Israel when the Arab states attacked her. And I know the the Zionists bought the land because I am still giving money to the organisation that buys land and builds irrigation systems and plants trees.

It's also not completely impossible to find the original documents of sale of specific parts of Israel from Turkish and British times. It's only inconvenient for anti-Semitic liars, because a "Jewish army" with a deed to the land doesn't fit into the image of the plundering Jew, does it?

The Palestinian Authority has a law against seeling land to Jews. Do you know why?

Guess:

A: Jews buy land. Arabs sell it to them.

B: Jews steal land. Arabs never sell them land.

Which scenario do you think the law is supposed to deal with?

And I don't care what the "Palestinians" fight with. They are not supposed to kill Jews using ANY method. And as long as they try, there will be consequences.

You can either deal with that fact and call on them to stop trying to kill us, or you can whine and lie and hope to keep the conflict going, getting rid of a few Jews and Muslims in the process. I somehow doubt that a self-proclaimed "Catholic" really has such a great interest in Muslim control over what Christians think of as the Holy Land. I think you just happen to hate Jews a bit more than Muslims, that's all.

What you need is some perspective. Your hatred makes you blind for the realities. You can learn from this guy:

http://www.israellycool.com/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/bedouin-wall.jpg

He is not an Israelite (probably, unless he is from the Jewish Bedouin tribe), but an Israeli.




But Leauki...it's time to GET REAL. Those defintions are what they are....the Messias came..."Emmanuel with us". Everything changed with the Christ's Life, Death and Resurrection.



Some things didn't change.

The Romans still hate us and feel a desperate need to name our country "Invaderland" ("Palestine") and give it to other people.

on Oct 20, 2009

http://www.flickr.com/photos/22284600@N07/2183363738

This is a picture of a so-called "Blue Box", design from 1940.

It shows how much land the Jewish National Fund had bought by 1940.

You can see that it is almost the entire coast line, much of the Galil to the lake, and parts of the northern Negev as well as most of Jerusalem.

The JNF controlled a bit more than half the land owned by Jews in the country.

The land was then under British sovereignty.

The land shown on the map on the box was neither owned by Arabs nor under the sovereignty of any Arab state (and hadn't been for hundreds of years).

If you look at the original plan for partitioning the Cisjordanian part of Palestine, you can see that apart from Jerusalem, the Jewish state was made up of the land bought by Jews, the JNF plus the Negev which was (and is) inhabited by Bedouins allied with the Jews.

That's the plan the Jews accepted and the Arabs rejected. And that's the Israel that was founded and then attacked by the Arabs.

Only AFTER the attack did Israel grow into areas not bought by Jews.

The Jews/Zionists did NOT "steal Arab land" causing the Arabs to "defend their land". The Jews bought land and lived on it until they were attacked.

Since then Israel has kept offering the land it took in exchange for peace, which the Arabs consistently rejected.

Either way, whether Israel should keep the land it won in wars or not, the land Israel was founded on was NOT stolen. And it is a typical anti-Semitic lie to claim that it was.

Either Jewish money is as good to you as anybody else's money or you are an anti-Semite. If you are not an anti-Semite you HAVE to accept that land Jews buy is after the sale THEIRS.

 

 

 

on Oct 20, 2009

I wrote another article with maps of the land bought by the Zionists and the UN partition plan:

http://citizenleauki.joeuser.com/article/367083/Buying_and_Stealing_and_How_Being_Jewish_Changes_Everything

 

on Oct 20, 2009

I have two questions for Lula.

1. The land you live on now, was it or was it not stolen from Indians?

2. If it was stolen, when are you planning to return it and leave?

If you bought it from the Indians or if the US won the land in a war in which the Indians threatened to defeat the US and kill all white Americans, I promise I'll be fine with you living wherever you live as long as you extend that same privilege to other peoplein your situation, even if they are Jewish.

But if neither of these are the case, I'll keep reminding you that you are not only a liar but also a thief.

Any American who believes that after many years even stolen land should not be returned to the descendants of the original inhabitants and who does not by the purest of coincidences define "many years" as "more years than the current state of Israel existed" or support the right of the thus dispossesed to use violence to get their land back is also absolutely icebox ("cool") with me.

 

 

on Oct 20, 2009

Only AFTER the attack did Israel grow into areas not bought by Jews.

The Jews/Zionists did NOT "steal Arab land" causing the Arabs to "defend their land". The Jews bought land and lived on it until they were attacked.

Since then Israel has kept offering the land it took in exchange for peace, which the Arabs consistently rejected.

Either way, whether Israel should keep the land it won in wars or not, the land Israel was founded on was NOT stolen.

The land was BOUGHT, not invaded.

Honestly buying land is a good thing. But taking over and confiscating other people's land by a varity of "legal devices" is official sanctioned theft.

Last I knew of International Law, it's illegal for a nation to occupy territorty seized in war to plant its citizens in the occupied land, build fences, plant housing developments. Furthermore, according to the Geneva Convention, the "occupying" party is responsible for the welfare of the civil masses in the occupied areas. Has Isreal done this burden?

  

on Oct 20, 2009

Honestly buying land is a good thing. But taking over and confiscating other people's land by a varity of "legal devices" is official sanctioned theft.

Good thing the Zionists bought the land.

 

Last I knew of International Law, it's illegal for a nation to occupy territorty seized in war to plant its citizens in the occupied land, build fences, plant housing developments.

Really? Please do find me these "laws".

I wonder why they apply to Israel but didn't seem to stop the US, Poland, Russia, and North-Vietnam; all countries who won land in war, annexed it, and allowed people to settle there.

(I also wasn't aware of the fact that Jordan and Egypt, when they controlled the West-Bank and Gaza constructed no buildings in the area.)

I am particularly curious which law prohibits the building of fences and walls in occupied territory, because that would totally criminalise the US who did build fences and walls in occupied West-Berlin. (I know, I had an ID card to pass through the gates into the special zones.)

Seems to me like there are a lot of "law" that apply to Israel only.

Luckily. assuming your knowledge of "international law" is correct, this will end the discussion. Because if annexing land in war is illegal, all annexations of Israel since the Jews lost it would be illegal, hence the land is still Jewish. I have no problem with that view. It's not the argument I usually use to defend Israel, but if you insist...

 

Furthermore, according to the Geneva Convention, the "occupying" party is responsible for the welfare of the civil masses in the occupied areas. Has Isreal done this burden?

Yes.

As I said before, with reference to the UN's own statistics, the living standard in the occupied territories is higher than in Egypt.

There is, however, no responsibility for the occupying power not to defend itself against attacks and neither, if I may add, count civilians used as human shields as "protected persons" under the Geneva Conventions.

 

on Oct 20, 2009

Wow, lots going on here.  Just a few comments and a question or two for Leauki.  Lots of talk about who this land belongs to and for any biblical Christian it's a no brainer.  First and foremost it's God's to begin with.  And he made it clear he was giving it to Abraham and to his descendants FOREVER.  This was called the Abrahamic covenant and was UNconditional.  If you wish, go back and read Genesis 15.  Abraham even asked God "Lord how shall I know that I shall inherit it?" 

It's plain to see in that Chapter that God swore fidelity to His promises and placed the obligation for their fulfillment on Himself alone.  The boundaries of this land was even given to make it very clear.  Israel today, doesn't even have a quarter of that promised to them yet.  It's still to come.  What we are seeing today is just the beginning. 



It was the Roman government of Judaea that had him killed, not "his people".

it's actually both Leauki.  His own (Jews) rejected Him and he was handed over to the Romans who were not overly fond of Him either but it was all instigated by the Jewish Authority.  These leaders set out to have him killed as soon as his popularity started to get in the way of their agenda. 

I already explained what "Hebrew" meant and yet you feel a strange need to replace my explanation with something wrong.

It is always a bit of a shock to me when you tell people what Hebrew words mean because I cannot figure out what your sources are.

let me help you here Leauki.  She does this all the time to me.  I'll write something and then she'll rewrite it, sometimes saying exactly what I just said or something that contradicts what I said without mentioning what I did say in the first place (check out my latest blog comments about the AC).  Sometimes it's like..."didn't I just say that?"  Or... "did she even read what I wrote?"  She's so busy writing a response, she's not listening to what we're saying.  "Be slow to speak and quick to hear" is not part of Lula's makeup. 

The reason this is happening is because she's writing from her RCC apologetics or encyclopedia type books without speaking from her own mind.  She is a RCC apologist in training and she's using us to sharpen her skills.  I know exactly what she's doing.  It's very apparent to see and has been going on for some time.  I can tell the diff when she's speaking to me or when she's rattling off information right out of the RCC handbooks. 

So now my question to you Leauki is do you or have you met any Palestinian Christians?  If so, what is their take on all this?  I know there is quite a movement over there.  This week at Thomas Road Church in VA a young Christian Palestinian couple was introduced visiting the states for just a bit before returning to the work in Israel as missionaries. 

 

 

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